MD more about SOM...

From: Troy Becker (
Date: Thu Sep 17 1998 - 06:11:01 BST

On Wed, 16 Sep 1998, glove wrote:

> i am a triangle in space, with my boundaries defined by me, my knowledge, my
> awareness of self. outside of the me, there exists a complementary triangle
> that contains everything not-me. i meet Troy. Troy also is a triangle in
> space, bounded by his me-ness, and also possessing a complementary triangle
> containing everything that is not-Troy. given that the me-triangle and the
> Troy-triangle cannot physically share the same space, and we cannot
> communicate at a distance, how do we communicate?

we won't be communicating anymore, if i can't shove you out of
conventional subjective-objective thinking. okay, okay, i'm lying. SOM
thinking is better than no thinking at all.

in your trangle example, as soon as you meet Troy, your triangles overlap.
the triangle you mentioned does not exist in space, so the you-triangle
and the Troy-triangle can easily overlap, and that is how we communicate.

but i'm shaking my head sadly, for you did not get my point.

you recently wrote (concerning the trouble of using ones and zeros):

> Troy, i would say this is the first moral conflict Pirsig describes, the
> chaotic-inorganic conflict. it could be said that everything in existence is
> composed of inorganic atoms, a one, and everything not in existence is
> composed of chaos, or zero. however this would be speaking SOMically, of
> course. so we have to substitute value for existence to speak correctly in
> MOQ speak, otherwise we create a platypus! for how can something exist that
> doesnt exist? so we can then say everything of value is a one, and
> everything without value, a zero. that is indeed about as simple as it gets.

what is your meaning? Quality comes before everything that exists and
everything that does not exist, right? Quality comes before the past?
Quality comes before the future? the relationship between one and zero is
Quality, for without value, there would be no one and there would be no

(regarding "the universe" and its complement) you wrote:

> Troy, it so happens i have been doing some serious thinking along these very
> lines. first of all, i cannot value 'nothing' and therefore i have no
> relationship with it that i am aware of :)

bop. it's Quality. do you feel enlightened? you seem to be stuck on
SOM, so i'll entertain it and put it in a framework you can understand:

you are a triangle of awareness, physical self, and knowledge. outside of
you (this is bleeding with subjective/objectiveness, mind you) is a big
thing with a triangle shaped hole in it. you. not you. Quality connects
it all. Quality carves your triangle out of "the rest of it", and you
carve your triangle out of (and in to) Quality.

one more time, on a larger scale, it is important to understand that there
is more to it than "all of it".

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