From: Sam Norton (elizaphanian@kohath.wanadoo.co.uk)
Date: Sun Nov 21 2004 - 09:52:24 GMT
Hi DMB,
It'd be good if you could come back on the list of things which I was trying to put together to
summarise your point of view. In the meantime two comments from your last post.
I had thought that the levels were discrete, and that a 'culture' was made up of social and
intellectual elements. What I'm trying to focus in on is how you understand the PP. Is it a social
level phenomenon (in which case, how do you reconcile describing it as 'like a chemically purified
abstraction'); or is it intellectual level (in which case, how does it relate to the social level,
eg language, ritual, etc); or is it a culture all of its own, with its own unique shape?
I'll come back to the other points when we agree a list of 'DMB beliefs'. But this is worth picking
up on:
> Sam asked:
> How do you know that "The distinction between myth and fact is a distinction
> between social and intellectual"? Can you explain why you think this is
> true?
>
> dmb says:
> This is really disappointing, Sam. This question was already answered in
> some Wilber and CAmpbell quotes I recently dished up and I must have
> presented the relevant Pirsig quotes at least a half a dozen times by now.
> Surely you see that Pirsig has made this clear throughout Lila?
Two things: 1. we disagree on how to read Pirsig on this; 2. your quotes, especially from Wilber,
are appealing to authorities which I do not necessarily recognise. Did you not listen to MSH the
other day when he said that we need to be able to express the thoughts in our own language and not
make external appeals? All I am asking is that you set out clearly in your own words how you know
that "The distinction between myth and fact is a distinction between social and intellectual". All
you have done so far is say 'Pirsig, Wilber and Campbell tell me that it is so, and I believe them'.
Surely you can do better than that?
Sam
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