From: ian glendinning (psybertron@gmail.com)
Date: Fri May 27 2005 - 06:09:12 BST
Matt, Mark,
I've not been following the whole of this interpersonal thread, but
when Matt says
"The reason I'd make a distinction between metaphysics and philosophy is
because I view metaphysics as an untenable dream, a dream we should give up.
I don't think its that no one _now_ has any clue about the way the world
really is. I don't think its _possible_ for anyone to know the way the
world really is because there would be no way of determining whether it were
really true. There are no criteria we could agree on for such a
determination and we have no idea what those criteria would even look like
if we'd found them."
This is exactly my pragmatic reasoning too.
Ian
On 5/27/05, Matt Kundert <pirsigaffliction@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Mark,
>
> Mark said:
> At this point in our evolution I don't think anyone has a clue about the way
> the world really is. There's lotsa smoke and mirrors and noise, so much
> noise, most of it meant to enhance the viewpoint of people who want more and
> more and want all of us to believe that they deserve it, they really really
> do.
>
> So, I go for option 2, though I don't understand why you'd make the
> distinction between philosophy and metaphysics. My metaphysics of the fully
> realized human being is the foundation of my "philosophy" of life, of good
> and bad, of right and wrong.
>
> Matt:
> The reason I'd make a distinction between metaphysics and philosophy is
> because I view metaphysics as an untenable dream, a dream we should give up.
> I don't think its that no one _now_ has any clue about the way the world
> really is. I don't think its _possible_ for anyone to know the way the
> world really is because there would be no way of determining whether it were
> really true. There are no criteria we could agree on for such a
> determination and we have no idea what those criteria would even look like
> if we'd found them.
>
> My inquiry as to your answer to the question is supposed to elicit what side
> of the fence you fall down on on the abstract philosophical question of
> foundationalism and essentialism. Your answer still leaves you with option
> 1, despite your choice of 2, because it seems like the dream of metaphysics,
> of figuring out the way the world really is, is still alive in your
> perspective. This dream is the thing that I sensed before and led to my
> original interlocution. I sensed that you would use "metaphysics" to denote
> a foundational dream, as opposed to simply singling out the assumptions upon
> which you make sense of the world you find yourself. If people do still
> have the dream, it makes sense for people to say that they have a
> metaphysics. If they don't (and they use metaphysics to denote that dream),
> it doesn't make sense for them to have a metaphysics at all. Just a
> philosophy. Which is why I say I don't have a metaphysics at all. Just a
> philosophy.
>
> Matt
>
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