Re: MD Primary Reality

From: skutvik@online.no
Date: Sat Jun 25 2005 - 07:16:22 BST

  • Next message: Allen Barrows: "Re: MD Clearing up this intellectual mess"

    On 21 Jun 2005 at 14:38, Matt Kundert wrote:

    > Please, please---do not call me a "heavy-weight." I get enough flak
    > for what I say, I don't need any more by being called "_this_ forum's
    > heavy-weight." There are enough heavy-weights around here, all
    > standing in different positions, to not try and rank them. The weight
    > or weightlessness of any particular person is easily felt by every
    > person, judging for themselves, by the very act of participation in
    > the MD. We don't need a chart.

    Hi Matt.
    OK no more "weighing".

    > But, I will say this, Bo: what I've realized in this last conversation
    > with you (which, pace you apparently, I'm not done with yet) is that I
    > always did, basically, understand what the SOL-MoQ was. It is,
    > apparently, what I first thought it was when I first read it
    > presented. As Platt just said, it isn't that complicated. What makes
    > it complex is your very obscure way of presenting it and trying to
    > differentiate it from other dominant interpretations, Pirsig's or
    > whomever's. (The thing with Paul is just bizarre on your part.) My
    > opinion right now is that the SOL interpretation of the MoQ is not
    > very different from the other ones, which makes the bombastic way you
    > present it seem a little much.

    Paul for one sees a fundamental difference between the SOL
    interpretation and the standard one (I am tempted to call them
    strong and weak with reference to Quantum Physics) re. intellect
    where the the latter sees the S/O as just one pattern. What Pirsig
    says is a bit unclear. In almost all of LILA he treats it as SOL, but
    when he turns to something called "intellect" it turns into
    INTELLIGENCE (which IS behind intellect in the way told earlier
    about the evolution of an idea of a mind).

    > I'm still not particularly sure about
    > the differences, but I think most of it has to do with certain
    > particular claims you make in presentation (like it being the "true
    > MoQ," which, I imagine, is part of the chaff thrown out after my
    > factory gets done), rather than the core message of it (except,
    > possibly, on one point).

    The true MOQ pertains to ZMM that explicitly says and draws
    diagrams of intellect as the S/O divide, all in all the SOL is over-
    documented unto exhaustion. Yet, this discussion clings to an
    intellect that has spawned the MOQ because of its
    INTELLECTUAL virtues. Bah! the MOQ has fought its way out of
    the SOM-intellect, because it goes against it fundamentally.

    All this about subject/object only one intellectual pattern is
    intellects very tentacles refusing to let go, striving to stay the
    spiritual realm where SOM, the MOQ and everything else said
    about the world resides. I was greatly believed that you saw this
    and now you can't really go back even if you want to.

    Bo

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