Re: MD Pirsig the postmodernist?

From: Matt the Enraged Endorphin (mpkundert@students.wisc.edu)
Date: Tue Feb 25 2003 - 19:31:36 GMT

  • Next message: Matthew Stone: "Re: MD Pirsig the postmodernist?"

    Matt,

    Matt S said:
    But if a thought could be analysed as being the
    movement of chemicals within one's brain (I know it's
    not that simple) couldn't you apply the MoQ to human
    tissue in the same way as you would to slate molecules
    or magnets and filings, thus casting the intellecutual
    level in the mould of the material.

    Matt:
    Sure. If you are saying that we can just as easily say that mental states
    are neural states and that neural states are just as easily framed as
    mental states, then yes. Pace Scott R, who argues that Rorty (my favored
    post-modern) is a materialist, I don't think there is a problem with saying
    that you can go back and forth between talking about neural states and
    mental states, depending on what you are talking about. I think Scott
    reads the mind-brain identity that Rorty uses in Philosophy and the Mirror
    of Nature as _reducing_ the mind to brain, but that's not the case. I
    think Rorty wants to simply say that some of the quandaries we find
    ourselves in in philosophy can be dodged by moving from talk about minds to
    talk about something else (e.g. neural states, language). It is about
    moving from an obsolete vocabulary, with all of its incumbent problems, to
    a newer vocabulary, which will naturally raise new problems.

    I think Pirsig's fundamental move is to redescribe reality, not in terms of
    material or ideas, but in terms of value. Technically, there is no
    material in the MoQ. There are only inorganic patterns of value. We
    formally thought of these things as material objects, but the redescription
    does away with that. Pirsig would redescribe neural states and mental
    states into valuing states. But I don't read Pirsig as _reducing_ us to
    valuing states. I read him as saying that some old problems disappear when
    you do this (though new ones will certainly arise).

    Matt

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