From: Arlo J. Bensinger (ajb102@psu.edu)
Date: Sun Nov 27 2005 - 01:29:25 GMT
[Platt]
"But the INVENTION of Dynamic carbon bonding represents only one kind of
evolutionary stratagem." (Lila, 11 emphasis added.)
[Arlo]
If "innovation" occurs on the inorganic level, it completely destroys your
premise that the Intellectual level should be renamed the "Individual" level
because only individuals innovate.
As for innovation occuring on all levels of the MOQ, I'd agree. Which is why
your suggestion to Randify the MOQ by renaming the Intellectual the
"individual" is amusing but baseless.
[Platt]
Dynamic and static are forever intertwined, but which drives evolution? Being
intertwined proves nothing.
[Arlo]
Which drives evolution? Both are necessary. Remove one, no evolution. Yin and
Yang, both equally important, and inseparable. As are the "individual" and the
"collective".
[Platt]
Your collectives are the illusion, Arlo.
[Arlo]
The human body is not a cell collective? Pirsig's social level "Giant" is not a
collective of biological organisms? (According to him it is). "Ideas" on the
Intellectual level are the collective product of many social level individuals.
Hardly an "illusion". Pirsig is wise enough to recognize the inter-dynamic
Yin-Yang of the "individual-collective". It undergirds his entire emergent MOQ.
It continues to be your Randian "individual" that is the illusion, and one that
has rightly been relegated to the dustbin of history.
[Platt]
I never saw a collective and never hope to see one.
[Arlo]
Look in the mirror. Your physical body is a cell collective. Look outside your
window, that city is a collective organism formed by "individual" biological
bodies. Pick up a book on Physics. The knowledge therein is a collective
emergent from the actions of social individuals. You see them, but that Randian
nonsense keeps you from "seeing them".
[Platt]
But I can tell you anyhow, I'd rather see than be one. And if you say I'm no
more than a collection of bone and tissue, I say you're missing the most
important part of who I am -- a potential responder to DQ. Tell me how that
"emerges" from your fabulous collective.
[Arlo]
Your physical body is not just a "collection of bone and tissue", but from the
collective activity of individual cells, a "higher organism" emerges. On the
cellular level, a virus is no more moral than DNA. But, the emergent human body
is a higher organism than any individual cell.
Who you are emerged from your appropriation of the collective consciousness of
20th century America. Your thoughts echo with the voices of who you've read
(historical dialogue), people you've talked with, movies, music and other
cultural dialogues. As you conceptualize your "unique proprietary experience",
you do so through the structure of the collective consciousness, to which your
words play back into and become a part of. From these individual activities
within the field of the collective consiousnes, emerges "higher level
organisms", such as Quantum Physics, the MOQ, calculus, and so on.
No "one individual" could have invented calculus, especially not in isolation
from the collective consciousness. Calculus emerged over time from the activies
of many people, and emerges as something greater than any one person, indeed,
on a higher level of evolution, the Intellectual level.
But you tell me, how are you a "potential responder to DQ" outside of the
collective consciousness of all communicating mankind?
To quote Rob Base and DJ Jazzy Jeff, "It takes two."
Arlo
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