Re: RE: MD MOQ human development and the levels

From: Joe (jhmau@sbcglobal.net)
Date: Fri Jun 06 2003 - 19:17:55 BST

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    On 6 June 2003 5:57 AM Platt writes:

    Platt:
    Well, I do make a distinction between words (concepts) and things. I try to
    keep in mind the independence of symbols from the things symbolized, the map
    from the territory, the menu from the meal. The words "existence," "object,"
    "subject," and "pattern of value" point to experience, but names for what we
    experience are not the experiences themselves. But here's the key: the names
    we use to describe experience have their origins in our metaphysics, the
    beliefs we hold about what our experiences mean. If we believe experiences
    stem from subjects who experience independent objects
    outside our skins, then for us that's reality. On the other hand, if we
    believe our experiences stem from patterns of value who experience Dynamic
    Quality and other patterns of value, then for us that's reality. Either way,
    experiences are the same. Only the metaphysics, the meanings and the words
    change.

    Hi PLatt, Johnny and All,

    joe: Platt, after all of your discussion with Matt EE about pomo, why do you
    describe metaphysics as "the beliefs we hold about what our experiences
    mean" ?

    I accept that I know things. As a child I learn things. As I grow older, I
    have different experiences. I do not accept the the 'words' I use were only
    learned at my mother's knee. I experienced word formation. Words are not
    just conventional sounds we agree about. How I know things became a focus
    of attention when Pirsig points out that I experience the indefinable.

    SOM is based on an abstraction by a mind existing in a body. MoQ points out
    that as a child I experience things and build my own knowledge base. My
    awareness generated by my DNA and is individual to me, not like a blank mind
    common to all people. That my awareness can become more complex with
    experience and use a mystical property to generate patterns and words as
    though they are my experience seems reasonable.

    In this way MoQ grows into SOM with the difference that MoQ has to be
    continuously used for verification, or else subjective, objective errors
    occur.
    Education is not just a SOM experience which involves mostly memory
    training. MoQ muscles must be strengthened as well. The girl in Phaedrus'
    rhetoric class was blocked and could not write about the building. Phaedrus
    asked her to focus on one brick, a MoQ approach to experience, and her block
    was removed.

    Joe

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