From: David MOREY (us@divadeus.freeserve.co.uk)
Date: Sun Oct 12 2003 - 16:50:25 BST
Hi
Nit sure what you are saying, please expand.
Certainly see key difference between dog and person
as the larger range of choice available to a person
due to a richer range of possibilities open to a person,
a person's future is more full and therefore more dynamic
than a dogs. Choice seems to imply indeterminacy and also
that beings are somehow involved in going from the indeterminate
to the actual/event.
regards
David M
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mati Palm-Leis" <mpalm@merr.com>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 4:22 AM
Subject: RE: MD Intellectual level - New letter from Pirsig
> David,
>
> I guess we need to demystify the idea of choice. A dog can make a
> choice as well as you can. Choice is no more than value patterns that
> exists in the pursuit of quality. In relation to the idea of the future
> existed in social as well as in the intellection and in some way has a
> limited meaning. In terms of quality, it is not so much that the future
> is so extraordinary; it is those patterns that will try to dominate the
> future when it gets here. :)
>
> Mati
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk
> [mailto:owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk] On Behalf Of David MOREY
> Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2003 1:47 PM
> To: moq_discuss@moq.org
> Subject: Re: MD Intellectual level - New letter from Pirsig
>
> Hi
>
> My point is that choice depends on alternative futures being available.
> I go to my fridge and can eat eggs or ham but not steak because I do
> not have any steak. In this situation (wanting to eat) at least 2
> futures
> are
> available the ham sandwich or the egg on toast. It seems to me that
> being
> human,
> having choice is very much related to this orientation towards the
> future in
> the context
> of the past, focus on the present is kind of meaningless, it ignores the
> situation (past)
> and the choices (given possibilities/future). The present is defined by
> past
> and future and otherwise is kind of
> meaningless.
>
> regards
> David M
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mati Palm-Leis" <mpalm@merr.com>
> To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
> Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2003 3:17 AM
> Subject: RE: MD Intellectual level - New letter from Pirsig
>
>
> > David,
> > I miss the point about the dog in trap 6, but ok I will comment on
> time.
> > Past and Future are not the cutting edge of reality, the present is.
> > Past and future before the time of language had very little meaning.
> > Choice it seem is part of the diversity of patterns and realities that
> > exist. Change occurs in time, in the present. Choices we as humans
> or
> > other living creatures make are in respect to the diversity patterns
> we
> > call life. Thinking is only is only one of the many patterns that
> exist.
> > Quality and especially DQ quality create the capacity for choice to
> make
> > changes for the good.
> >
> > Mati
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
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