Magnus Berg (MagnusB@DataVis.se)
Tue, 7 Oct 1997 05:28:19 +0100
Diana wrote:
>I realize that descriptions and examples are a form of definition, but it's
>too easy for someone to come along (as Magnus did) and point out that these
>are not precisely definitions in the sense of a formal statement of the
>meaning or significance of a word. It is this type of formal statement that
>I believe is impossible.
But what harm could come from trying?
>
>Pirsig compares establishing metaphysics to planning a chess strategy. If
>you start off by saying "here are the definitions of the four levels" sooner
>or later your opponent is going to point out that they are not precise
>definitions. And then you are going to have to say "yeah well descriptions
>and examples are kinda like definitions." You would be in a far stronger
>position if you called them "descriptions and examples" right from the
>start.
I still don't like imprecise descriptions in the long run. What you
describe
sounds a little cowardly. An imprecise description opens up for
ambiguities
and are hard to develop, and that's a bad thing IMO. The right way to do
it
is to specify the definitions as precise as you can and make it possible
for others to find faults and inconsistencies. The 'opponents' as you
call
them, are then invited to join the development of the definitions and
make
them better.
>
>> If you really mean this, we're really starting to understand each other.
>> A human with a warm coat and a good pair of shoes is a society (a
>> composition of organic patterns) that can better withstand cold
>> weather than a human without them. Therefore, the coat and the
>> shoes (and the human) are organic patterns to that society.
>
>Sorry, no, a warm coat in a cold climate would be biological because it
>keeps the person alive - thus propagating biological value. No social value
>here. (Unless it was a designer coat)
A good example of the limits of general idea descriptions. We just
can't resolve this disagreement using them, and it's very hard to see
the origin of it because of the vague definitions used.
Magnus
>
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