clark (clark@netsites.net)
Wed, 9 Sep 1998 01:48:51 +0100
Troy and Squad,
Troy wrote:
free will? i have at least as much free will as has the universe, and
that's mighty humbling and freeing at the same time. since i am part of
"the pattern", i have my place and i will do what i will. i am static and
i DO static. that seems like a tight collar, but i am such a complex,
thinking thing that it is clear to see that i do more for the sake of DQ
than does a rock. i hope it is clear.
Clark wrote:
I believe that you have hit the nail on the head with the statement, "i
have at least as much free will as has the universe, and that's mighty
humbling and freeing at the same time.
In my view we are trying to answer the wrong question. We should ask,
"Does the universe have free will?" not, do we have free will?
As I see it, we are deterministic with regard to the universe, it is the
universe that has free will. That is not to say that the universe did not
start as a deterministic system, but that the universe has become
effectively non-deterministic due to the increasing complexity (range of
possibility) that has resulted from the myriad number of static latches
that have occurred so far in the thermodynamic journey of the universe
toward complete randomness. Complexity is still increasing and will
continue to do so. Meanwhile we will still be there riding the coattails of
the deterministic disorder of the universe.
It could happen, given the supposed time remaining in the life of the
universe, that there will come a time when there will no longer be an
intellectual level operating in the universe. Would this prospect in any
way alter the current thinking?
Horse, you and I seem to be operating along a similar track. Or maybe I
am just absorbing your ideas.
Rambling on: I see references to time being an independent entity on
which the universe runs. Someone correct me if I am wrong but my
understanding of time is that it is also relative and an inseparable part
of the functioning of the universe, linked with velocity, gravity, mass,
and whatever else I can't think of at the moment.. A rock represents frozen
time.
Diana wrote:
The very notion of free will is inseparable from the notion of subjects
> and objects. To even speak of it is to show that you've swallowed the
> subject-object metaphysics whole.
Clark wrote:
This makes sense. That is why I tend to think that we are deterministic
creatures riding the coattails of an effectively non-deterministic
universe.
Glove wrote:
Sometimes these 4 levels restrict my ability to think.
Clark wrote:
Me too. That is why I prefer to view them as an artificial construct to
make explanation easier. Everything else in the universe is inextricably
connected. Why should the four levels be different?
Roger wrote:
However, he ends
> the topic by stating that the explanation of life is a migration of
static
> patterns toward DQ. Is DQ a goal that life goes toward?
Clark wrote:
In my view, Quality is the "Force for greater information content in the
universe" that has resulted in the story of the universe that we have been
able to piece together. Quality was present at the beginning and was
responsible for the range of possibilities that were established at the
beginning.
Dynamic Quality in the MoQ (after sentience) represents the function that
makes selections from our ongoing fields of awareness under the influence
of the instantaneous condition of our static Patterns of Value. This is a
deterministic function that is effectively non-deterministic because of the
growing complexity of the urgings of the underlying physical universe and
is a continually ongoing process. As I see it, DQ is not a goal but simply
a force that is directed by our individual previously established Static
Patterns of Value. In this view every individual's truth is different and
is determined by one's previous individual history.
In the sense that each individual is progressing toward a better grasp of
the "story of the universe" then DQ is a moral (towards greater value)
function.
I've had about all the fun I can stand so I will send this off. Ken
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