----- Original Message -----
From: Cwhite6248@aol.com
To: moq_discuss@moq.org
Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 08:46
Subject: Re: MD and MF
Hi Soj,
I agree with you and we do as a society set out to establish
those concepts as understood by just that exact method you describe in Risky
Business.
However when folks get together to analyze and attempt to formalize they
embark on a neverending spiral into minutia that stagnates the process of
overview with focus on the minute. Im a fan of "farmer Logic" the use of
old mots and saws to illucidate advanced points of view. My goal in life
would be to find universally accepted generic language tools that do exactly
what you describe. I am so off put by pseudo-technical jargon. Keep up the
dialog and the references to the most universal icons like Casteneda, and
the rest of the seers and shamans and poets who enliven the otherwise dead
and decaying self-seeking plunge into eliteist formality. :) Just my
humble opinion...... They are busier than cats covering up shit on a tin
roof.
Clay
I have to save some juice for a later post to Rog (I hope that's right) so
let me say a brief "sermon" on Farmer Logic:
"Old mots and saws" I assume is a fancier way to say sayings. There's a
fabulous book of them from the 1300's (sorry
in Spanish) and what it is also known around town I think is: conventional
wisdom.
We'll skip the "conventional" part for a minute and focus on the "wisdom".
I seem to feel a wing of this discussion list
(and how fabulously diverse it is and I love it!) is coming in from the
Zen/buddhist/mystic/eastern illusion thinking
wing and the other wing is more the "theoretical motorcycle" wing (this
would be philosophy majors/teachers/lecturers).
The word wisdom is a word like quality that you can lay it on a table and
everyone has enough to eat. However what is
wisdom but a form of "knowing what the right "thing" is". Maybe the right
"thing" is knowing what the right thing to do is. It sure was wise of John
to invest in Coca-Cola in 1898. Wisdom seems to also be used as someone who
has mastered static latching of some very dynamic Quality. The "wise"
buddha is the buddha who returns to the marketplace. The one who SQ'd the
DQ of nirvana or enlightenment. Wisdom seems to be reaching out into the
nebulous galaxy of the unknown and bringing something back useful for HERE.
Conventional wisdom seems to be the passed SQ traits of the culture. "This
has worked before over and over". Saying it is "farmer logic" is just a way
to de-emphasize it. The Bible of the Christians is chock a block full of
some very good conventional wisdom. It's definitely one of the reasons it
has ENDURED. Conventional wisdom or "Farmer logic" is just the workhorse of
the Zen wing of this list.
As for the cats on the tin roof I smiled when I saw that however my
denunciation of that "theoretical mechanic" wing is a little less harsh. I
think of them as people who are trying to build really good airplane
simulators. Of course they aren't the real thing! But every pilot flying is
a better pilot for all those simulations. And the theoretical mechanics are
the ones who simulate the breaking point of the machine (philosophy)
beforehand so we know what it can and cannot handle.
Hope this clears things up. And I do appreciate the support from the Zen
wing, and you know who you are (and a surprising number of you are running
email programs in French for an unexplained reason).
--Soj
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