Hi David and LilaQs,
I strongly disagree with you on the following.
DAVID (13 Jan)
http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/9901/0121.html
>The
>intellect thinks it has the ability to change all things, to "conquer
>nature". Or so it seems. But actually its ability to manipulate reality
>is only in a localized sense and then only on the surface of things. In
>the case of inorganic patterns of value, for example, we humans have
>made flint knives, forged iron swords and detonated atomic bombs. We
>have seemingly altered the rocks, the ore and the plutonium with the
>intellect. But in all three cases the underlying patterns of value have
>not been altered at all, merely exploited. Further we can only "change"
>those specific and local patterns of value, but the nature of all
flint,
>iron ore, and plutonium in the universe. We can only change the shape
of
>the flint, not the nature of the molecules within it. We haven't really
>changed the iron to make our sword, we've only purified the element and
>re-arranged its molecular structure. And the bomb that splits the atom
>only works because of the pre-existing attributes of the plutonium
atom.
>In each case the intellect was only moving patterns of values around,
>not changing them. All the intellect can do is take advantage of the
>inherent structure and qualities of the patterns of value.
A nuclear fission explosion is created by concentrating a CRITICAL MASS
of plutonium to create a chain reaction. The chance of this happening
naturally is virtually nil. We have no evidence that there ever was such
a natural occurence on Earth. Much more commonly, plutonium decays
radioactively by alpha radiation, yielding other elements which continue
to decay, ultimately to lead. This is NOT what happens in nuclear
fission. It is an alternative. The two possibilities are mutually
exclusive.
>
>At the biological level it works the same way. You can mix what nature
>has produced, but we can never really change it. You can kill a dog.
But
>there you're just mixing the dogs patterns of values with the patterns
>we call gun shots or poison. You can breed dogs, but all you've done is
>mix the patterns we call DNA. But the intellect can't evolve a new dog,
>all it can do is take advantage of those biological patterns that allow
>things like death and sex to occur in the first place.
You can mix genes in a combination nature could never have come to by
chance. I agree that nature may ALLOW the combination, but is one of an
almost infinite number of alternative combinations. Practically, the
only way this particular combination is realized is by the planning
action of intellect.
One can make a similar argument for intellect selecting certain social
patterns over others.
Thus, the wielding of Intellectal power (planning) can very greatly
change the patterns which constitute reality.
It chooses between the possibilities nature allows i.e. EXPLOITS nature
to serve some (intellectually determined) purpose. In so doing, it
denies other alternatives which nature might otherwise favour.
I've written a fair bit on this under various headings, talking about
DESIGN, PLANNING, ENGINEERING -
This goes all the way back to last August if not before (check the
archive).
Also relevant is my very recent post (12 Jan) with the subject line
CHOICES archived at
http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/9901/0096.html
Regards all,
Jonathan
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