Hi Jonathan, David L., Dan and Group:
Like David, Dan and others, I join Jonathan in seeing the morality 
topic as something terribly difficult and hope we can work together 
to, as Jonathan put it, “make some real progress” towards 
illuminating it.
I see the overall questions as still being, “Does the MOQ provide us 
with a useful moral compass? If so, how can it help us decide 
moral/ethical issues?”
Of course, nearly all the posts on this site touch on these 
questions to one degree or another. But few that I recall tackle a 
moral issue head on and use the MOQ to solve it. In fact, the only 
one I can remember was posted by Bo a long time ago on the 
subject of eugenics, although there may be others I’ve missed. 
(There was a long debate about the wisdom of dropping the atom 
bomb to end WWII, but nothing resolved in MOQ terms.) In any 
event, it seems we’re still far from agreeing on what the MOQ offers 
in the way of a method for solving real-life moral problems like the 
one David L. described in response to Jonathan’s assertion that 
“Saving life is good.”
“What if administering the drugs (chemo for cancer) decreases the 
quality of the person’s life even though they extend the length of 
that life? (Similar to being put on life support, we’ve saved the “life” 
but is it moral?)”
I think for us to get anywhere in this terribly difficult area we must, 
as Jonathan suggests, agree on a “satisfactory definition of what 
morality actually is.” If we can’t all begin with a common 
understanding of what we’re talking about, I see little hope we’ll 
accomplish much. I know this sounds terribly simplistic, but as 
someone said in stating the obvious, the longest journey begins 
with the first step.
So here’s my offering for the beginning axiom of morality (an axiom 
being a seminal concept that itself cannot be proven but which 
claims its validity in that it must be used in the attempt to deny it): 
The axiom is: 
“Some things are better than others.”
I think this is also Pirsig’s beginning axiom. In Lila, Chapter 12 he 
writes:
“When inorganic patterns of reality create life the Metaphysics of 
Quality postulates that they’ve done so because it’s “better” and 
that this definition of “betterness,” this beginning response to 
Dynamic Quality, is an elementary unit of ethics upon which all 
right and wrong can be based.”
David L. put it another way.
“Whatever I do in my life, I do it because in my view (based on my 
understanding of the circumstances) it has the highest 
reward/lowest cost ratio. Is that not moral?”
If we accept the axiom that some things are better than others 
(whether measured in terms of cost/benefit or otherwise) and that 
this is what morality means, the next question is, “Better for whom 
or what? Better for me? For you? For society? For all of life? For 
the universe? This is where, as Pirsig says, all moral problems 
arise, and boy do they get complicated. Dan made the point when 
he quoted Pirsig:
 “Morality is not a simple set of rules. It’s a very complex struggle 
of conflicting patterns of values.”
If the MOQ is to be of any help at all in dealing with moral 
questions, it has got to help answer “Better for whom or what under 
what circumstances?” The general thesis of the MOQ is that, all 
other things being equal, freedom (change) is better than order 
(stability) (Dynamic vs. Static), and that biological patterns are 
better than inorganic, social patterns better than biological, and 
intellectual patterns better than social. How far does this get us? If 
all of our discussions in the past are any indication, not very. 
I agree with Jonathan’s advice that “we have to proceed very 
carefully from the ground up, and not assume that Lila has all the 
answers.”
So I stand on the beginning ground of the axiom, “Some things are 
better than others” and say that from this ground, all moral 
problems and ultimately their solutions arise. Does anyone agree? 
Can we all accept that as a basic starting point for discussions 
about morality? 
Platt
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