Re: MD A bit of reasoning

From: David Morey (
Date: Sun Oct 17 2004 - 13:02:15 BST

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    Scott: I am saying that when Pirsig sees the intellectual level as something
    get through on the way to pure DQ he has missed something: that,
    occasionally, we are DQ.

    DM: I do not think he says this. I think he says that DQ is necessary to
    creare all the levels. There are the first three levels of static patterns
    and then a forth that we need to name. An intellectual level with
    intellectual products on it seems fair enough. Actually I have gone
    off the word static as clearly these patterns do evolve and do not emerge
    at once in a complete state. How about 'enduring' patterns of EQ.
    And dynamic also seem to mean emerging quality, but damn it that's EQ as
    well. So enduring quality emerges on all levels. I think the intellectual
    on the levels increases as we get to the highest level, so I agree witrh
    that intellect does not emerge exclusively with the 4th level. It is also
    that human being are both made up of enduring quality and also open
    up to the possibility of new qualities emerging i.e. DQ. I think when Pirsig
    says pre-intellectual he means DQ has the quality of something new, it may
    require the clearing (at a new level) to be prepared by SQ but into the
    clearly emerges something
    new. Scott thinks that the emerging and new forms that will become SQ have
    evidence of intelligent formation/creation. I agree. I do not think Pirsig
    disagree either. But I think Pirsig wants to hint at the newness most by
    saying we could not foresee intellectually this new form/pattern. I think
    who have great insight often feel this shock at what emerges before them.
    So I think we have intellectual products but with something new emerging not
    just the same again being rearranged. Here what emerges, emerges from
    beyond the individual, from a more cosmic source, both beyond us but also
    revealed within us.


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