From: platootje@netscape.net
Date: Wed Aug 31 2005 - 08:26:27 BST
Hello Ham,
>Where have you been keeping yourself?
On the beach in France actually :-)
And sorry for this late reply, I found out yesterday a lot of MoQ messages had been classified as Spam and were in a Spam-folder....
Ham:
>For what it's worth, I like that analysis -- and your emphasis on the
>metaphysics. I really don't see how the sophists here can shoot holes in
>what you've stated. More significantly, it demonstrates in two short
>paragraphs what is needed to make the MoQ a logically workable metaphysics.
>
>Now that you've shown us the problems, how do you propose to resolve them?
>
>One suggestion, which I've pointed out before, is that if the world we see
>"through judgmental glasses" is defined as "existence", then the Dynamic
>Quality that we don't see must transcend that existence. For that reason,
>rather than asserting that "all that exists is Quality", I would say that
>Quality is the primary or essential reality. (Let the scholars battle over
>whether DQ logically "exists" or not.)
I agree with this. I accept your definitions of existence and essence in this area.
> In any case, that "we experience" is
>the pivotal point of existence. Without the locus of individual awareness
>there is no existence.
By your definition of existence, this is correct
>Is there Quality without the experience of it, then? There, you see, is
>Pirsig's dilemma. If he answers 'yes", he's a transcendentalist; if his
>answer is 'no', he's a nihilist: there is no point in existence. As the MoQ
>now stands, man just happens to be here with no cosmic purpose behind his
>existence. It's not enough to say that the world moves toward "betterness"
>simply because there is Quality. Why even bother with an undifferentiated
>essence if it has no teleological meaning?
>
>That question, too, must be be resolved in order to complete the thesis.
>(You can see there's a lot of work remaining.)
If you can translate the question to 'is there essence without existence' my answer would be 'yes, and maybe existence is keeping us away from the essence'.
Kind regards,
Reinier.
__________________________________________________________________
Switch to Netscape Internet Service.
As low as $9.95 a month -- Sign up today at http://isp.netscape.com/register
Netscape. Just the Net You Need.
New! Netscape Toolbar for Internet Explorer
Search from anywhere on the Web and block those annoying pop-ups.
Download now at http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archives:
Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Wed Aug 31 2005 - 10:55:19 BST