Re: MD Sit on my faith.

From: khoo hock aun (
Date: Tue Feb 10 2004 - 13:30:47 GMT

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    Mark wrote:
    > Are you telling us all that It's now officially OK to be a Christian and:
    > 1. Not believe in God. 2. Not believe in Jesus. 3. Not believe in the
    > birth. If so, i may be going to church this Christmas!

    > [ Scott:] Again, you need to disabuse yourself of this notion of the
    > automatic Christian. They come in all shapes and sizes, just like
    > and MOQists.

    Dear Scott and Mark,

    If I may intervene - there is a speculative and of course controversial
    proposition about Jesus having
    lived in India. The following rather long synopsis of "Jesus Lived In India"
    by Holger Kersten
    was written by Dr Ramesh Manocha & Anna Potts:

    " The Russian scholar, Nicolai Notovich, was the first to suggest that
    Christ may have gone to India. In 1887, Notovich, a Russian scholar and
    Orientalist, arrived in Kashmir during one of several journeys to the
    Orient. At the Zoji-la pass Notovich was a guest in a Buddhist monastery,
    where a monk told him of the bhodisattva saint called "Issa". Notovich was
    stunned by the remarkable parallels of Issa's teachings and martyrdom with
    that of Christ's life, teachings and crucifixion.

    For about sixteen years, Christ travelled through Turkey, Persia, Western
    Europe and possibly England. He finally arrived with Mary to a place near
    Kashmir, where she died. After many years in Kashmir, teaching to an
    appreciative population, who venerated him as a great prophet, reformer and
    saint, he died and was buried in a tomb in Kashmir itself.

    The first step in Christ's trail after the Crucifixion is found in the
    Persian scholar F. Mohammed's historical work "Jami-ut-tuwarik" which tells
    of Christ's arrival in the kingdom of Nisibis, by royal invitation. (Nisibis
    is today known as Nusaybin in Turkey) . This is reiterated in the Imam Abu
    Jafar Muhammed's "Tafsi-Ibn-i-Jamir at-tubri." Kersten found that in both
    Turkey and Persia there are ancient stories of a saint called "Yuz Asaf"
    ("Leader of the Healed"), whose behaviour, miracles and teachings are
    remarkably similar to that of Christ.

    The many Islamic and Hindu historical works recording local history and
    legends of kings, noblemen and saints of the areas thought to be travelled
    by Jesus also give evidence of a Christ like man; the Koran, for example,
    refers to Christ as "Issar". Further east, the Kurdish tribes of Eastern
    Anatolia have several stories describing Christ's stay in Eastern Turkey
    after his resurrection. These traditional legends have been ignored by the
    theological community.

    Kersten also suggests that prior to Christ's mission in the Middle East, he
    may have been exposed to Buddhist teachings in Egypt. After his birth in
    Bethlehem, his family fled to Egypt to avoid Herod's persecution.
    Surprisingly some scholars now acknowledge that Buddhist schools probably
    existed in Alexandria long before the Christian era.

    More clues are drawn from the Apocrypha. These are texts said to have been
    written by the Apostles but which are not officially accepted by the Church.
    Indeed, the Church regards them as heresy since a substantial amount of the
    Apocrypha directly contradicts Church dogma and theology. The Apocryphal
    'Acts of Thomas', for example, tell how Christ met Thomas several times
    after the Crucifixion. In fact they tell us how Christ sent Thomas to teach
    his spirituality in India. This is corroborated by evidence found in the
    form of stone inscriptions at Fatehpur Sikri, near the Taj Mahal, in
    Northern India. They include "Agrapha", which are sayings of Christ that
    don't exist in the mainstream Bible. Their grammatical form is most similar
    to that of the Apocryphal gospel of Thomas. This is but one example giving
    credibility to the idea that texts not recognised by the Church hold
    important clues about Christ's true life and his teachings.

    In tracing Christ's movements to India and beyond, Kersten also discovered
    that many of his teachings, which have been gradually edited out of the
    modern Bible were originally Eastern in nature. Principles such as karma and
    re-incarnation, for example, were common knowledge then, and seem to have
    been reaffirmed by Christ. Imagine the implications that this discovery
    holds for Western Christianity and its churches, who have kept Christ in
    their doctrinal top pockets and have constrained the entire Western culture
    within the narrow teachings of blind faith, organised religion and original

    Further clues are cited from The Apocryphal Acts of Thomas, and the Gospel
    of Thomas which are of Syrian origin and have been dated to the 4th Century
    AD, or possibly earlier. They are Gnostic Scriptures and despite the
    evidence indicating their authenticity, they are not given credence by
    mainstream theologians. In these texts Thomas tells of Christ's appearance
    in Andrapolis, Paphlagonia (today known as in the extreme north of Anatolia)
    as a guest of the King of Andrappa. There he met with Thomas who had arrived
    separately. It is at Andrapolis that Christ entreated Thomas to go to India
    to begin spreading his teachings. It seems that Christ and Mary then moved
    along the West coast of Turkey, proof of this could be an old stopping place
    for travellers called the "Home of Mary", found along the ancient silk
    route. From here Christ could easily have entered Europe via France. He may
    have even travelled as far as the British Isles, for in England there is an
    ancient oak tree called the "Hallowed Tree" which (says local legend) was
    planted by Christ himself.

    In his travels through Persia (today's Iran) Christ became known as Yuz Asaf
    (leader of the Healed). We know this because a Kashmiri historical document
    confirms that Isa (the Koranic name for Christ) was in fact also known as
    Yuz Asaf. The Jami - uf - Tamarik, Volume II, tells that Yuz Asaf visited
    Masslige, where he attended the grave of Shem, Noah's son. There are various
    other accounts such as Agha Mustafa's "Awhali Shahaii-i-paras" that tell of
    Yuz Asaf's travels and teachings all over Persia. It seems that Yuz Asaf
    blessed Afghanistan and Pakistan with his presence also. There are for
    example two plains in Eastern Afghanistan near Gazni and Galalabad, bearing
    the name of the prophet Yuz Asaf. Again in the Apocryphal Acts of Thomas,
    Thomas says that he and Christ attended the Court of King Gundafor of Taxila
    (now Pakistan), in about 47AD, and that eventually both the King and his
    brother accepted Christ's teachings. Kersten claims that there are more than
    twenty one historical documents that bear witness to the existence of Jesus
    in Kashmir, where he was known also as Yuz Asaf and Issa.

    For example the Bhavishyat Mahapurana (volume 9 verses 17-32) contains an
    account of Issa-Masih (Jesus the Messiah). It describes Christ's arrival in
    the Kashmir region of India and his encounter with King Shalivahana, who
    ruled the Kushan area (39-50AD), and who entertained Christ as a guest for
    some time. {Christ's life in India, after the crucifixion, challenges
    current Church teachings at their very foundation. The theology of Saint
    Paul, the major influence on modern Christianity, is empty fanaticism in the
    light of this discovery.|

    The historian Mullah Nadini (1413) also recounts a story of Yuz Asaf who was
    a contemporary to King Gopadatta, and confirms that he also used the name
    Issar, ie. Jesus. There is also much historical truth in the towns and
    villages of Northern India to prove that Jesus and his mother Mary spent
    time in the area. For instance, at the border of a small town called Mari,
    there is nearby a mountain called Pindi Point, upon which is an old tomb
    called Mai Mari da Asthan or "The final resting place of Mary". The tomb is
    said to be very old and local Muslims venerate it as the grave of Issa's (ie
    Christ's) Mother. The tomb itself is oriented East-West consistent with the
    Jewish tradition, despite the fact it is within a Muslim area. Assuming its
    antiquity, such a tomb could not be Hindu either since the Hindus
    contemporary to Christ cremated their dead and scattered their ashes as do
    Hindus today.

    Following Christ's trail into Kashmir, 40km south of Srinagar, between the
    villages of Naugam and Nilmge is a meadow called Yuz-Marg (the meadow of Yuz
    Asaf, ie. Jesus). Then there is the sacred building called Aish Muqam, 60km
    south east of Srinagar and 12km from Bij Bihara. "Aish" says Kersten is
    derived from "Issa" and "Muqam" place of rest or repose. Within the Aish
    Muqam is a sacred relic called the 'Moses Rod' or the 'Jesus Rod', which
    local legend says, belonged to Moses himself. Christ is said to also have
    held it, perhaps to confirm his Mosaic heritage. Above the town of Srinagar
    is a temple known as "The Throne of Solomon", which dates back to at least
    1000BC, which King Gopadatta had restored at about the same time as Christ's
    advent. The restoration was done by a Persian architect who personally left
    four inscriptions on the side steps of the temple. The third and fourth
    inscription read: "At this time Yuz Asaf announced his prophetic calling in
    Year 50 and 4" and "He is Jesus -- Prophet of the Sons of Israel"! Herein
    lies a powerful confirmation of Kersten's theory.

    Kersten suggests that Christ may have travelled to the South of India also,
    finally returning to Kashmir to die at the age of approximately 80 years.
    Christ's tomb, says Kersten, lies in Srinagar's old town in a building
    called Rozabal. "Rozabal" is an abbreviation of Rauza Bal, meaning "tomb of
    a prophet". At the entrance there is an inscription explaining that Yuz Asaf
    is buried along with another Moslem saint. Both have gravestones which are
    oriented in North-South direction, according to Moslem tradition. However,
    through a small opening the true burial chamber can be seen, in which there
    is the Sarcophagus of Yuz Asaf in East-West (Jewish) orientation!

    According to Professor Hassnain, who has studied this tomb, there are carved
    footprints on the grave stones and when closely examined, carved images of a
    crucifix and a rosary. The footprints of Yuz Asaf have what appear to be
    scars represented on both feet, if one assumes that they are crucifixion
    scars, then their position is consistent with the scars shown in the Turin
    Shroud (left foot nailed over right). Crucifixion was not practised in Asia,
    so it is quite possible that they were inflicted elsewhere, such as the
    Middle East. The tomb is called by some as "Hazrat Issa Sahib" or "Tomb of
    the Lord Master Jesus". Ancient records acknowledge the existence of the
    tomb as long ago as 112AD. The Grand Mufti, a prominent Muslim Cleric,
    himself has confirmed that Hazrat Isa Sahib is indeed the tomb of Yuz Asaf!

    Thus Kersten deduces that the tomb of Jesus Christ Himself is in Kashmir!

    The implications of Kersten's discovery are monumental. Christ's life in
    India, after the crucifixion, challenges current Church teachings at their
    very foundation. The theology of Saint Paul, the major influence on modern
    Christianity, is empty fanaticism in the light of this discovery. Threatened
    also are the doctrines of obedience to the Church, original sin, salvation
    through blind faith and the non-existence of reincarnation, etc. Yet these
    ideas underlie the morality and ethics, (or lack of them), that govern the
    entire Western social structure, from the legal system to medical health
    care schemes. It is no wonder that the modern Churches and their secular
    interests refuse to consider such a proposition as Kersten's!"

    Khoo Hock Aun

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