Bodvar Skutvik (skutvik@online.no)
Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:18:53 +0100
Tue, 02 Jun 1998 23:50:23 +0000
Magnus Berg <qmgb@bull.se>
wrote:
> Horse wrote:
> > At times it appears to be what drives the process of change - Evolution?
> > - whilst at other times it is that level/process/phenomenom(?) beyond
> > Intellect. How does something that is so seperate from knowable patterns
> > of value interact with them.
A very good question which I hope we may reach some conclusions
about.
> I think we should be careful not to call DQ a level. Remember that the
> SQ/DQ split is the first. SQ is then divided into four levels, DQ has
> nothing to do with that division.
I agree with Magnus here.
> I think DQ is always as you said '...what drives the process of change'.
Yes, definitely. I have my special metaphor of the process as
our childhood challenge of crossing a pond on icefloes too small to
carry one's weight, you had to run or sink. There is never a
"rest" to evolution, it has to move on or degenerate.
DIANA
cited LILA where Pirsig elaborates on the dynamic/static
relationship, for instance as demonstrated by the Zuņi Brujo story
which started him on the DQ/SQ division instead of the
romantic/classic one of ZMM. Worth noticing is that P. retains ZMM's
formulation: "The pre-intellectual cutting edge of reality".
LUKE
brought up a homely example of the dynamic/static
relationship (hopefully my reply will materialize soon) I said it
would be problematic postulating dynamic intervention for all
situations when something "pre-intellectual" takes control and
perform feats we afterwards can't explain. And yet here it looks like
P. says that dynamism is part of ALL experience, something the
enigmatic "hot stove" example also implies:..."A 'dim perception of
he knows not what' gets him off dynamically".
To me the underlying dynamism is the PRINCIPLE, but the
"unconscious" quality of certain feats (like split-second
decisions while driving a car) as well as automatic responses to
experiences like hot stoves is the static biological level at work.
Intellect can't cope; the valuation has to be instantaneous. The
social level can also cut in as it does when we feel uneasy in
certain situations even if Intellect says it is normal.
(Of course the physiological explanation is the autonomous nerve
system and all that, but that has no bearing on this discussion).
JONATHAN
offered an interesting aspect when he wrote:
> This SQ develops based on DQ. However DQ also depends on
> SQ because it is experience which determine what gets noticed.
Yes, in the sense that each static level in its dynamic phase is a
liberation from and yet the offspring of its parent level, but
Dynamic Value - as such - is the unending source and can hardly be
dependant upon anything else.
Bo
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