From: Arlo J. Bensinger (ajb102@psu.edu)
Date: Wed Sep 08 2004 - 03:16:48 BST
Hi Jon,
> The thing is, socialist societies aren't generally very exciting. The
> exciting nature of capitalism inspires people to really utilize their
Intellectual
> Level.
I wouldn't put the medal exclusively around the economic free market. Other
"free" areas are needed (education, voting, art, etc.).
If inspired, they WILL find a way to get exactly the kind of education
> they want (not the kind society tells them they should want).
Agree. Although, I do believe that exposure to areas where one may not be sure
one's interest would point is a relevant and important part to education.
But another question emerges. If one sees history, politcal science, American
government and the "like" (from an American perspective) as irrelvant or "not
important", should it be "required" as necessary to function (and make informed
decisions) in our present system.
I can tell you I am on the fence with this, but my feeling is that few younger
people see the importance of being educated in our (or international) history.
And yet this is "key" to functioning in a global society, or voting
intelligently in local/federal elections.
So, do we enforce certain aspects of the curriculae, or do we allow those who
choose to remain uninformed to have equal say in "the system"? I ask this only
rhetorically, to suggest a point.
> And yes, in ways that help every one. See, capitalists *want* the
> fruit of their intellectual level to be of use to everyone for a very high
> quality reason: more people will buy it! And then perhaps employ people to
> manufacture it, etc.
The problem here is that you have fully bought into the myth of "altruistic
capitalism". Remember history, "capitalists" did not create a "better society",
they created Dickens-esque industrial, enslaved wastelands. The "free market"
you know today is the result of labor activists and regulations. Removing them
will not create utopia, it will slide us back to where we were (think Gary,
Indiana). E.g., the "employees" of Pullman (the railroad guy) were not bettered
(if so, how?). "Capitalism" is concerned only with the acquisition of wealth,
and the idea that "the market" or general altruism keeps the market "fair" is a
myth, evident to any student of history. Some may say "things are different
now, *now* unfettered capitalism won't do those things", I say hogwash.
We need a "free market", most certainly, but we cannot depend on "the market" or
the capitalists themselves to keep it "free". I will no doubt be called a
"socialist" for this (so be it), and I've discussed this at length with Platt
in posts earlier this summer. My belief is that the "free market" remains "most
free" only when there are safeguards, and that to trust "capitalists" as
altruistic... well, I'd caution against it.
Ultimately the problem with socialism is that they think dumb
> people are morally obligated to do all the real work for smart people (who
need
> to spend all their time thinking, rather than working).
Really? Interesting... all the socialists I know are laborers, not philosophers.
I think the problem with capitalism is that it assumes people can move from
laborer to capitalist freely (if the skill is there). The capitalists in this
country have gone to great lengths to promote this myth, but still the rich
tend to remain rich and the poor tend to remain poor. Capitalism attributes
this to laziness, or sloth, or some weakness. I believe it is more attributed
to entrenched hierarchy, or static social patterns.
That's moral right?
> Stupid people should work, smart people should think.
Isn't this what happens in a capitalistic society? Not that I believe any one to
be "stupid" (except right-wing radio pundits ;-)), but what alternative do you
see capitalism as affording?
Arlo
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