From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Sat Oct 22 2005 - 19:57:12 BST
Rebecca:
> Alright...
> This is what I do with my life (and my studies) so I guess it's time to
> ante up. Before I get on with it, however, please don't consider this an
> attack. I'm only trying to state a different point of view. Perhaps we can
> come to some kind of conclusion about the essential differences between our
> perspectives.
Actually our perspectives are similar.
> Platt:
> > Well, I wouldn't know. I haven't ever been to Havana. I have been to
> > Prague which I found extremely dull and depressing.
> ... Really? I heard Prague has exceptional night life and a thriving art
> community. Perhaps there's a difference between what you and I believe to
> be exciting, or conversely dull. :)
Perhaps. I'm not into night life or art communities.
> PLatt:
> > No. Roads serve the economic needs of everyone.
> Rebecca:
> Yes they do. Checkmark on agreement here.
> Platt:
> No. Education is necessary to support the intellectual level..
> Rebecca:
> It's good for things other than that as well, it's also important for our
> economy and the proper functioning of our society. If persons aren't taught
> basic literacy and numeracy skills they're had put to function in society.
Agree
> Platt:
> I put into this category welfare programs which substitute for private
> insurance and savings programs such as Social Security, Medicare, national
> health insurance, food stamps, aid to dependent children, etc. that enable
> people to shift responsibility for the quality of their lives onto the
> backs of others, ending up depending on handouts. We ought to encourage
> self-sufficiency instead of freeloading.
> Rebecca:
> I entirely agree that we ought to encourage self-sufficiency instead of
> freeloading. I think the way we differ in thinking, and the reason may
> persons are irritated by these kinds of programs, is that they do not
> function the way they were intended to.
Agree.
Rebecca
> I believe these programs are important. They were devised during a time of
> great social and economic upheaval (the Great Depression of the 1930s) to
> provide a safety net so that millions of Americans (and Canadians) did not
> simply up and die. They are now being used not as a safety net but as a
> means of living, which is entirely inappropriate in my view.
I doubt if millions of Americans would have died during the depression if
it wasn't for Social Security, the WPA, the NRA and other programs of that
era. But be that as it may, I agree food stamps, aid to dependent children
and other "war on poverty" programs of the Johnson era are now being used
as a means of living and are inappropriate.
Rebecca
> One of the reasons that social programs aren't doing very well in the US
> is
> because the education system in many places is in grave danger. If you
> don't educate people properly, they're going to 'make due' however they
> have to. When your options are finding a horribly unsatisfying McJob that
> pays $3.50/hr or sitting at home, hanging out with your kids and living off
> the government, the decision is not difficult to make.
> Citizens need to be educated as to what their options for employment/
> retraining are... they also need to be given encouragement and motivation.
> There are some genuinely lazy freeloading people out there who would rather
> do anything than work; these people are going to find a way to screw the
> system no matter what you do. Most people who are on welfare have a lot of
> options... the problem is that if your uneducated and only semi-literate
> you probably have no clue those options exist.
I agree that our government education system is by and large a colossal
failure although not entirely to blame for the large numbers of the semi-
literate. Many refuse to make the effort necessary to learn.
Rebecca
> Perhaps you should set up a self-sufficiency program in your community
> Platt. Show people how to get jobs and stop living off the government. I
> know you'd have less time for MOQ discuss, but you'd be making the world a
> better place :)
There are plenty of resources available in my community to those who are
motivated to become self-sufficient. But so long as those welfare checks
keep coming, I don't see much hope, do you?
Platt
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