Re: MD Heroes, ethnocentrism, Qualtiy, and War

From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Fri Mar 14 2003 - 22:48:12 GMT

  • Next message: Elizaphanian: "Re: MD Heroes, ethnocentrism, Qualtiy, and War"

    Hi Andy:
     
    > Your replies were, of course, expected. And they are not the imaginative
    > thoughts I am looking for. THanks anyways.

    Sorry to disappoint.
     
    > You said:
    > Well, without universals, it's just your opinion against the dictator's.
    > And he's got the guns.
    >
    > Andy: Yes, and this is why we need some vision. The way out is to make it
    > the world's opinion against the dictator or any other unelected leader who
    > has the guns. I can see progress in achieveing this vision around the
    > world today.

    Where?

    > You answered my: There is something to be said to the secret police.
    > Mainly, “Get the hell out of my house.” with:
    >
    > Like that's going to really scare them away.
    >
    > Andy: Of course, by the time the secret police comes through the door
    > there will be little to do to deter them from achieving whatever objective
    > they came with to achieve. So, I don't suppose my telling them to leave
    > will scare them. However, the point of this statement was to make it a
    > priority of any society to prevent abuses of power that allow the
    > infringement of civil liberties by governments and the secret police. In
    > America, I don't presently see progress in this vision.

    Where do you see better constitutional protections than in the U.S.?

    > You suggest:
    > What needs to be done to dictators who intentionally use overt physical
    > force on others is to kill them like bugs.
    >
    > I wonder: What price do you put on such an objective. How many innocent
    > civilians would you be willing to let die "like bugs" while trying to
    > squish this dictator. I don't have much sympathy for brutal dictators
    > anywhere in the world, but killing people "like bugs" is the most inhumane
    > suggestion one can imagine. Thanks for putting some thought into your
    > reply though.

    Which of the following wars would you not have fought?

    American Revolution
    Civil War
    World War II against Germany
    World War II against Japan
    Korean War
    Gulf War

    > Finally, you remark:
    > I guess so. Utopia is still a dream.
    > Platt
    >
    > Andy: Indeed, and what would life be if we weren't allowed to dream?

    No one, not even the most ruthless dictator, can stop you from
    dreaming . . . or thinking.

    Platt

    MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
    Mail Archives:
    Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
    Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
    MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net

    To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
    http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html



    This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Fri Mar 14 2003 - 22:48:36 GMT