Re: LS Program: Instant cloning

From: diana@hongkong.com
Date: Tue Feb 09 1999 - 13:13:28 GMT


Squad,

Rob wrote
>Step 1. There exists an unique, solitary, indivisible entity called "I".
>Step 2. SOM assumption. Reality is only made of matter and energy.
>Step 3. "I" must somehow be defined in terms of matter and energy. (From 1
and 2).
>Step 4. A tiny unit of matter and energy does not contain (define) "I".
>Step 5. "I" can only be identified/defined by a macro system (recipe) of
matter and energy
>not specific to any part.
>Step 6. Anything only defined as a recipe can be reproduced.
>Step 7. Step 6. Contradicts step 1.

The way you put it there's a contradiction, but I think your SOM assumption
is not quite right. As I understand it, the SOM says that there are two
realms of reality: subjects who know things and objects which are known
things. That's basically what Descartes said. So "I" can only be either
psychic or physical. But the SOM later went on to decide that ony the
physical is real. And finally it comes to the bizarre conclusion that the
psychic is actually a feature of the physical, as well as possibly being
separate from it.

So let's see if the MOQ can do better

To go back to step 1.
>There exists a unique, solitary, indivisible entity called "I".
Yes it is undeniable that that is the way the world seems to us. It may not
be the "Truth" about reality, but we absolutely have to accept that the
perception exists and that that perception has value.

My interpretation of the MOQ is:
* Reality can be either dynamic, intellectual, social, biological or
inorganic.
* The perception "I" is an intellectual pattern that filters and
interprets the various values that have converged around an individual body
* "I" changes if any of the factors that creates "I" changes
* So if we could reproduce those factors precisely then we could
reproduce "I"

>Step 6. Anything only defined as a recipe can be reproduced.

So, if we could define the levels we could reproduce them.

But as we've discovered before we really can't even define the static
levels, let alone dynamic quality. Proof: noone has yet defined life, noone
has yet defined consciousness. If we could recreate the patterns then yes,
obviously, we could recreate them. But that's like saying if we could make
pigs fly then that would prove pigs can fly, and then patting ourselves on
the back for our contributions to science. We need to be a bit more careful
or else we're talking nonsense. Creating life/awareness is not something
that we can just take for granted, for goodness sake.

Diana

MOQ Online - http://www.moq.org



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