To GLOVE:
You are over my head.I have to start from the basics on your creation and
discreation concepts. I don't understand why they help clarify morality.
Please help me along here.
To Roger:
these concepts help clarify what significance each level of the Metaphysics
of Quality has, much like your own chart. it seems to me that in many posts
social and intellect level patterns of value are mixed freely. there is no
method of distinguishing a social pattern of value from an intellect pattern
of value. my creation/discreation concept bloomed several months ago while
working on a paper contrasting Pirsig and Castanedas writings. in
Castaneda's "philosophy" all interactions between the self and the
environment are social interactions.
in putting that thinking towards the Metaphysics of Quality it became
increasingly clear to me that our everyday reality is fundamentally what we
call social level patterns of value with intellect patterns of value arising
from these social interactions thru what we call "automatic thinking". but
trying to say what that "automatic thinking" is turns out to be impossible.
we call it instinct or gut feeling simply because we have no other analogy
to call it.
i am trying very hard to put this concept into something compatible with the
Metaphysics of Quality and yet i also realize it entails looking at the
world in a different way as well, and that too tends to make what should be
a very simple idea into something much more difficult to form agreement
with.
Roger wrote:
Next , I need to understand what you mean that social patterns are always
creative and
intellectual patterns are always destructive. How is the theory of
relativity
destructive? Why does the blank 4th part of decision making have to be
destuctive?
Roger, the patterns themselves are not creation or discreation...rather
these static patterns of value are directed by forces of value towards
Dynamic freedom. the theory of relativity is not in itself destructive, but
the fact remains without Einsteins contributions to our ideas about reality,
the atomic bomb probably never would have been built.
furthermore, i would say that when the theory of relativity was conceived,
it was an intellect pattern of value opposed to other social patterns of
value of the time. but now it has become a social pattern of value due to
our acceptance and agreement with it.
in the experiment, the blank 3rd period contains no value. it is my proposal
that this period is composed of de-latching value forces which, unless
recognized as such, will indeed have no value as our awareness of these
forces is lacking.
actually the whole concept is probably over-simplistic as incredibly complex
interactions are occurring at each level creating and discreating reality.
however it seems to me that these value forces have been pretty much ignored
so far and that by recognizing them we can open up new pathways of
understanding. and i am trying to simplify the idea as best i can.
part of the reason for the difficulty in understanding these concepts lay in
the fact that they have never been discussed before, to my knowledge, and
therefore much static latching is involved to see if there is any value in
the idea. i will continue to try and expound on the concept until it becomes
more clear to me.
thanks for reading and responding.
best wishes to all,
glove
http://members.tripod.com/~Glove_r/Jaynes.html
Force of Values in the Metaphysics of Quality
http://members.tripod.com/~Glove_r/Bohr.html
Quality is a "Good" Dog; Pirsig and Castaneda Compared
~ Never lend strength to that which you would be free of ~
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