JOHN:
But as the example of the tune on the radio makes clear, there is in fact
no
sharp division between dynamic and static, but rather a continuum. The
dynamic
element is still present to some extent even as the song is becoming defined
as 'good' in a static sense. It may still be possible to catch a small
element of the dynamic surprise after dozens of playings.
Avid:
Here John you have to address a few questions:
1. How come that a song [or any other SPQ] can change its quality?
2. How is it possible that a song can continue to surprise you?
3. What is Surprising still in a known song?
If you don't mind I'll give you my solutions [that go well IMO with MoQ].
You treat mistakenly [as far as I understand MoQ] the song as a given Object
[of SOM]. This is not true according to MoQ. In MoQ you have a NEW
EXPERIENCE EACH TIME THE SONG IS PREFORMED, From this each time new value
you can be surprised, change your value judgement of the song etc.. What you
call "the DQ containment of the song", is not DQ, but the quality of a given
situation in which the song participates. Only when this quality cannot be
pinpointed to belonging to anything, this is DQ [a moment of inspiration
etc.], but then by saying it was DQ it, you say it was more than a good
song.
ROGER:
Again, DE is DQ. It is always dynamic. We have learned to filter and veil
experience. To pattern it and use this trick to run on autopilot. This is
basically a very effective and successful process. However, we can tend to
overdo it. We begin to live in our patterns and filter out the greater
world
of experience.
The song has already been experienced, so we don't need or want to attend to
it any more. But as you mention, if you really listen, there is much
dynamic
experience still to be discovered. Pirsig values sq, but always reminds us
to go back to the source and to constantly seek new, superior experiences
and
patterns.
Avid:
Here we differ. IMO we are used to see the song as the same [in different
experiences], because of SOM. Here we have no direct experience to quality
but access to quality via a song, and IT HAS TO BE EXPERIENCED, the SPQ
tells us how [audience code].
As Gestalt creatures, we recognize SPQ and try to match between the
experienced quality and various SPQ options. Only by default we land on DQ,
trying to form a new SPQ with its remains. It is not a matter of veiling, it
is a matter of recognition time, accessing the necessary code is vital for
biological [and higher] survival. If we gaze in the beauty of the Atomic
mushroom, it is too late.
On the other hand to say that the one time experience of a song is
sufficient to fix our judgement is the road to Dogmatism, which leads to
rigidity, which IMO is of low quality [or quality reducer]. To experience
things anew each time is a great quality checkup [ask any production line],
and a better way to ensure high quality.
and don't forget to be gentle
Avid
icq 6598359
MOQ Online Homepage - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archive - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Unsubscribe - http://www.moq.org/md/index.html
MD Queries - horse@wasted.demon.nl
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Sat Aug 17 2002 - 16:03:11 BST