Re: Ham; Re: MD Is Morality Relative?

From: Steve Peterson (
Date: Wed Dec 08 2004 - 11:50:09 GMT

  • Next message: Platt Holden: "Re: Ham; Re: MD Is Morality Relative?"

    Hi Ham,

    > Ham (to Platt):
    >> Philosophy is not an art form or a word game.
    > Steve replied (to Ham):
    >> In the MOQ, reality is quality and philosophy is an art form. So is
    >> motorcycle maintenance. If you can try to see everything as art, you
    >> will open yourself to understanding the MOQ.
    Ham said:
    > YOU are playing a word game, it seems to me! I'm not.

    Everyone is. It is true that philosophy is a word game, more a language
    game, though I think calling it a game trivializes it.

    "Language is the liquid that we're all dissolved in. Great for solving
    problems after it creates a problem." - Modest Mouse

    > I don't believe everything just because the MoQ tells me so. It
    > appears that
    > you do.

    I just don't understand how someone supposedly familiar with Pirsig's
    works comes on a discussion group about Pirsig's works and makes an
    asshole statement like "philosophy is not an art form" as if it were a

    It's not about believing everything the MOQ tells you. It just seems to
    me that if one is going to participate in this group he should at least
    be open to understanding what the MOQ is. If you're not open to the
    most fundamental of MOQ premises even for the sake of argument (Reality
    = Quality), then... I don't know what.

    > If I needed my motorcycle repaired, I certainly wouldn't hire an
    > artist to
    > fix it. (Fortunately, I don't have a motorcycle.)

    You wouldn't want a visual artist, anyway.

    But what kind of a person doesn't even own a motorcycle? Just kidding.
    I just sold mine this fall. Couldn't keep it running.

    > If philosophy were simply a word game, it would have no influence on
    > human
    > history, ethics, culture, morality, spirituality, history, science, or
    > religion. Obviously, it has. If word games are your thing, I can
    > recommend
    > one or two other sites that would welcome your skills.

    No it's not *just* a word game or *simply* a word game.


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