From: ian glendinning (psybertron@gmail.com)
Date: Tue May 10 2005 - 21:55:59 BST
Re-sent ..
Mark,
I guess I answered your second question first - about social
interaction - my pet topic. The basic question about what Pirsigian
Quality actually is, I passed over.
I'm surprised no other MoQ'er has intervened yet - I'm not the expert
and, for one thing, don't see MoQ as "metaphysical", since I don't
personally believe in metaphysics. But that might be my problem.
I suspect you are confusing common sense every-day use of the word
"quality" in your "quality of artistic output" or "quality of your
answer to an exam question" sense, with Pirsig's MoQ meaning. Which I
understand as the immediate experiencing of the "out there" by the
conscious "subject" - the idea that this triplet is more fundamental
than either subject or object independantly.
You wouldn't be the first to see a nihilistic conclusion to the
inclusion of the subjective aspect in "reality", but I have to say - I
see the opposite. Every reason to take Quality more seriously than
mere objectivity.
Someone will shoot me down though.
Hang on.
Ian
On 5/9/05, Mark <mark@antelope.nildram.co.uk> wrote:
> Hello ian,
>
> Monday, May 9, 2005, 8:44:19 AM, you wrote:
>
> ig> Mark, I certainly do not believe you have the wrong end of any stick there.
>
> My real bother about the understanding I've developed - and I add
> again that I'm in no way sure that it's correct - is that it makes the
> MOQ a profoundly depressing, disempowering, hopeless viewpoint. I
> presume that the MOQ doesn't apply to forms of quality which are
> already directly understood, such as the "quality" of a
> multiple-choice exam answer sheet as calculated by comparing given
> answers with a set of predetermined correct ones.
>
> So the implication would be that it's necessary to nail down the
> "quality" of things into concrete physical terms and, if you can't do
> so, then the quality is dissociated from anything that you can affect
> and all you can do is hope. So for instance, you can study for your
> multiple-choice exam, but there's no point practicing writing essays
> or music - that's metaphysical quality, so no matter how you practice,
> it's beyond your powers to exert even a slight influence on the
> quality of the output!
>
> I really, really, hope I'm wrong... (errr)
> --
> Best regards,
> Mark mailto:mark@antelope.nildram.co.uk
>
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