RE: MD Intellectual Art (Dynamic Morality)

From: Platt Holden (
Date: Sun Apr 06 2003 - 16:20:57 BST

  • Next message: Platt Holden: "Re: MD Intellectual Art (Dynamic Morality)"

    DMB, Scott, All:
    > > > "Quality is uncharacterizable" is a self-refuting statement, as it
    > > > characterizes Quality.
    > >
    > > Yes. To say we can't define ultimately reality is to define it.
    > >
    > > > Sometimes self-refuting statements are useful. Actually, I'll go
    > further,
    > > > and say that sometimes they are necessary.
    > >
    > > How so? Please explain. Like the sound of one hand clapping perhaps?
    > DMB says:
    > I don't think it needs to be all that fancy, Gents. Even if we could say
    > that its indefinability constitutes a definition, which I don't think we
    > can, the problem is really just one of linguistic construction. To say it
    > is beyond definition is not to define it, it is simply the negation of any
    > definition. The meaning of the statement is not actually self-refuting at
    > all and so we don't need any ironic koans about paradoxes or anything else.
    > The assertion can be re-phrased to avoid the appearance of
    > self-contradiction very, very easily because its not really there in the
    > first place. We could say that it is beyond all concepts, including
    > definability and indefinability.

    To say it is beyond all concepts is itself a concept. To say anything
    meaningful at all presupposes thoughts, ideas, notions, i.e., concepts.
    Linguistic constructions are concepts. Self-refuting statements are
    concepts. There's one way out. "Whereof we cannot speak thereof we
    must be silent." --Wittgenstein


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