Re: MD culture and basics

From: Bart Scholten (
Date: Tue Apr 06 2004 - 21:57:29 BST

  • Next message: "Re: MD culture and basics"

    Hello Mark,

    Many thanks for helping me on the way. I have now also printed the textbook
    by Anthony McWatt. Your explanations do help. for the next days and weeks I
    will be reading a lot. I do like the term tension, it feels right.
    Being educated in îexact╣ math I still have the tendency to îmeasure╣ and
    label the world around me. Also I am quit fresh on these topics as I only
    read ZMM and Lila last year for the first time. I look forward to expanding
    my knowledge on the subject.


    > Hello Dan and others,
    > In this context I want to mention that I notice some biasing in the current
    > discussions toward personal and cultural views. This to me is confusing
    > since it takes us away from the basics of MOQ.
    > Mark 6-4-04: Hello Bart, It may help if you consider two points:
    > 1. You may wish to consider what 'you' are in MoQ terms more carefully?
    > 2. What culture is in MoQ terms more carefully?
    > With regard to 1 'you' are composed of four static repertoires of patterns
    > evolving in response to DQ. Culture, (2) is merely the sum total of all these
    > repertoires. Therefore, tensions in the total repertoire may be viewed from an
    > evolutionary perspective.
    > Bart:
    > If the intellectual level is an evolutionary phase, how come it has not
    > evolved more and how come that early cultures that had a high degree of
    > intellect have vanished completely, did these cultures not have enough
    > quality?
    > Mark 6-4-04: Evolution in MoQ terms is value evolution, and forms a continuum
    > which is not limited to Humans. Thus, intellectual patterns of evolution can
    > survive their initial evolutionary emergence (through literature, etc.).
    > 'Cultures' come and go, but Intellectual and social patterns transcend. It is
    > the Quality of these patterns which survive.
    > Bart:
    > What also still puzzles me is where the personal quality perception should
    > be placed. I myself regard Norway as having higher quality than The
    > Netherlands, after having lived there for almost 10 years.
    > Mark 6-4-04: Your personal repertoire of patterns evolves in a continuum
    > within which there may be found tensions. The total is all the while evolving
    > in a relationship with DQ. But your repertoire of patterns IS to some extent
    > relationally immersed in a web of SQ-SQ tensions.
    > Bart:
    > So some expressions of Quality are personally biased and some are culturally
    > bound, right?
    > Mark 6-4-04: Culture is not a value level of its own. In MoQ terms it would be
    > better if you considered the nature of Intellectual and social patterns
    > instead?
    > Bart:
    > How can we overcome this limitation. Dynamic Quality certainly
    > does not have these limitations I can see that, but where do we go from
    > there?
    > Mark 6-4-04: What may at first appear to be a limitation can dissolve within a
    > broader format? The MoQ provides this broader format:
    > An answer may be to consider static repertoire. All your intellectual patterns
    > form a total static repertoire which is evolving in relation to DQ. Your
    > repertoire is constantly changing and evolving - sometimes assimilating
    > patterns from literature, people, the internet, etc. - sometimes rearranging
    > the repertoire in bricolage fashion - maybe at other times being genuinely
    > creative and developing new patterns.
    > This same process may be repeated for the other levels also, with diminishing
    > evolutionary acceleration - the lower levels evolve far more slowly than do
    > the higher ones.
    > Bart:
    > In order to move MOQ forward in the same way as e.g. Einsteins relativity
    > theory, it has to have universal value and should not be limited by cultural
    > interpretations or biases, therefore my nagging about culture.
    > Mark 6-4-04: When the MoQ is assimilated into the sum total of the
    > intellectual static repertoire and socially approved, then the MoQ will have,
    > in effect, become what may be said to be the dominant cultural intellectual
    > perspective.
    > We should avoid using the term 'culture' i feel, as this is better explained
    > in the MoQ vocabulary by considering the four levels of value evolution.
    > Regards
    > Bart
    > All the best,
    > and i hope you do not mind my trying to help Bart?
    > Mark

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