From: David Buchanan (DBuchanan@ClassicalRadio.org)
Date: Sat Jun 12 2004 - 23:47:44 BST
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Steven Heyman [mailto:markheyman@infoproconsulting.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 5:44 PM
To: moq_discuss@moq.org
Subject: Re: MD Mussolini: Splendid chap.
On 3 Jun 2004 at 15:22, SWZwick@aol.com wrote:
msh said
Fascism and big business go hand in hand, from the totalitarian
structure of corporations, to state supported business subsidy, state
adventurism and market/resource expansion, state intervention in
crushing labor movements. It's a match made in heaven.
SWZwick@aol.com wrote:
Then why does the word "state" pop up so much more often than the
word "business" in this post? The fact is that any concentration of
power, minus transparency and accountability, will lead to tyrany.
Why single out "big business"?
msh says:
Because this quote was part of message suggesting that American
policy toward Fascism, despite the outward label of Isolationist, was
really quite cozy. Since, as John Dewey suggested, "The government
is the shadow cast over society by Big Business" (true more so now
than ever), showing how business might find Fascism attractive
provides some support for my claim.
But I agree, any concentration of unaccountable power will lead to
tyranny. It's just that in the US (and other western powers) there
is a demonstrable symbiotic relationship between business wealth and
government, or such would be my position, if anyone wants to pursue
the thought.
SWZwick@aol.com wrote:
I'd argue that big business in the form of corporations provides a
democratic opportunity for shareholders (especially civic-minded
shareholders like the California state employee pension system
CALPERS) to take an interest in a company, demand transparency, and
influence accountability.
msh says:
Well, I think we have different views about the reasons corporations
are formed. You might want to look back over the Moral Evolution of
Society thread to see some of my ideas. Or maybe not.
Anyway, as we've seen time and time again over the last century, the
accountability and transparency of corporations is largely illusory.
This is by design. In modern corporations, CEOs and other
executives, BODs, and major stockholders, can be held criminally
liable for anything they do or say that can be shown to negatively
impact profit-making, no matter what effect such profit-making has on
the environment, or individuals, or society as a whole. You might
want to take a look at a recent book/movie, The Corporation. You can
google it for links.
SWZwick@aol.com wrote:
The comingling of state and enterprise is just as bad as the
comingling of state and religion.
msh says:
True. And what I've suggested above is that big business goals and
the goals of state are inextricably intertwined in the US (and other
western powers) to the extent that the two are often
indistinuishable. And to wrap it all round to the original question
here's the definition of Fascism: "A system of government that
exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the
merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent
nationalism."
--American Heritage Dictionary
BTW: Thanks for the very reasonable questions, and for the calm way
in which you presented them. It was a pleasure responding.
Best,
Mark Steven Heyman (msh)
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