Hello,
My name is Ryan Terry
I am new to the group
my message is to Cory
Cory,
I understand what you are saying but I think that Glenn has a point.
also, remember that it is immoral for the Parent(society) to repress the
child(intellect) but it is also immoral for the child to kill the parent.
people like Dick Rigel (Glenn) play an important part in the balance of life.
Society is there to control biology, correct?
well to some people the use of drugs could be classified as biological
drugs and alcohol alter our biology and chemistry
remember if biology destroys society according to the MOQ this would be
immoral.
So all that Glenn was saying was that we need to control our biological
urges to resist the overuse of a drugs and the destruction of society
I am not saying that drugs are altogether bad
they have biological quality
I think that the dynamic quality that Pirsig talked about when he took
peyote had nothing to do with the drug but a feeling that was already
embedded in his subconscious.
again I am new to the group so I may be completely off base. You guys are
the intellectuals, and the experts on all the evils of society right? I'm
just a lowly iNTp
At 11:34 AM 3/14/00 -0600, you wrote:
>
>
>Glenn wrote:
>
>Hello Jaap,
>Thank you for commenting on my post.
>
>But first, for all who read this from David B:
>"Finally, I can "testify" to this kind of experience [taking drugs]. And, my
>friends, homecoming doesn't even begin to describe it. Take the "ah haa!" of
>your greatest insight, the "oh my God!" of your greatest orgasm, add them
>together, multiply it by a thousand and then you'll be in the general area
>of
>the ball park."
>
>At the risk of having you lecture me about how western society should
>re-examine
>drugs, I'm going to stick my neck out and say a very uncool, unhip, Dad-like
>thing. This paragraph of yours is irresponsible. We should at least assume
>there
>are some impressionable people on this forum, particularly those on the
>younger
>side who are "searching", who might take your "testimony" and do something
>stupid with drugs and end up hurting themselves, either by overdosing or
>developing an addiction. Not everyone can experiment with a drug and leave
>it
>alone. You make drugs sound legitimate and safe because they're used in
>Indian
>ceremony, but it's well documented that American Indian reservations are
>hotbeds
>of drug and alcohol abuse. Were you aware of this? -- End of Public Service
>Announcement.
>
>Hi Glenn and David
>
>For the last few years I have been working with Habitat For Humanity
>building low-cost homes in different areas of the United States. In 1997 we
>did an eleven-home project in a particularly poverty stricken area of
>western Nebraska which took roughly three and a half months. It was the
>experience of a lifetime.
>
>Yes there is alcoholism on the reservation. And drugs. And crime. And
>crushing poverty. I wouldn't really call it a "hotbed of drug and alcohol
>abuse" however. I would say it is more of a slow burning deep seated rage
>that has no outlet. The young warriors can no longer be warriors. So they
>line up 4 and 5 deep at the Indian bars every weekend. They steal Grand
>Dad's peyote buttons and make themselves sick and afraid and so they drink
>even more.
>
>Now I am not opposed to a drop or two myself after a long day in the hot
>sun, and so I got to know all this by being involved. One apprentice, Mike
>Young Fox, invited me along on several barhopping tours which I always
>graciously accepted. None of the other HFH workers would go; there were
>several advisories issued suggesting that no one go into the Indian bars at
>all as whites were subject to harassment and even violence in some cases.
>Mike assured me there would be no problems and he was always right. I could
>not have chosen a better friend to show me the real side of life on that
>reservation. I have yet to meet a more open-hearted and generous people.
>
>Once I was accepted in the general community, Mike introduced me to his
>grandfather. I'll call him Hector. I learned later that this has always been
>the way of the tribe... a new member must be accepted by the group before
>being introduced to the inner circle, so to speak. Hector was what we whites
>might call a prophet or a seer. He would often just break into a weird chant
>in the middle of a conversation while peering deep into my eyes. Hector was
>also well-known as a peyote master and I was invited to several peyote
>ceremonies, which I also graciously accepted.
>
>I won't speak of that here... it's too personal yet. I will say though that
>four is a very sacred number in the ceremony. The buttons are always given
>out in groups of four. If the MOQ was born in a peyote ceremony then we can
>see the significance of four levels very clearly.
>
>Finally, before being too harsh and documentary towards the Native
>Americans, remember the Goodness in their hearts and thank God you have a
>toilet to crap in when you need it. Many of them do not. :(
>
>That being said, the tone of Glenn's anti-drug sermon seems very Dick
>Rigel-ish to me. Remember he too was concerned about the impressionability
>of Capella. Social morality rearing its ugly head perhaps?
>
>Cory
>
>
>______________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
MOQ.org - http://www.moq.org
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Sat Aug 17 2002 - 16:03:20 BST