Date: Thu Jan 08 2004 - 19:59:08 GMT
Hey Mark and all,
In response to Mark's request for textual context, I would offer the
PIRSIG (SODV--- discussing his MoQ diagram):
"In the third box are the biological patterns: senses of touch, sight
hearing, smell and taste. The Metaphysics of Quality follows
the empirical tradition here in saying that the senses are the starting
point of reality, but -- all importantly -- it includes a
sense of value. Values are phenomena. To ignore them is to misread the
world. It says this sense of value, of liking or disliking,
is a primary sense that is a kind of gatekeeper for everything else an
infant learns. At birth this sense of value is extremely
Dynamic but as the infant grows up this sense of value becomes more and more
influenced by accumulated static patterns. In the past
this biological sense of value has been called the "subjective" because
there values cannot be located in an external physical
object. But quantum theory has destroyed the idea that only properties
located in external physical objects have reality."
This quote is typical of a thread that runs throughout out Pirsig's thoughts
in LILA and on the MoQ in general. Pirsig often makes reference to a 'sense
of betterness' (like with the Brujo) or a 'sense of quality' (like with
Lila). Now, I am not qualified to pronounce on whether quantum theory has
destroyed the idea that only properties located in external physical objects
have reality, but my own 'sense of quality' tells me that there is something
weird about the idea presented above. Unfortunately, I'm a little pressed
for time tonight, but on Saturday I will send a post detailing my problems
with the above.
Thank you Rick,
This makes your original question more clear to me.
May i draw your attention to diagram 2 in The edge of Chaos (TEOC) please?
There, you will see the event stream, or DQ, radiating a coherent 'cloud' of
static patterns. The first patterns in the stream are Intellectual
and this is intended to indicate that the whole MoQ is an intellectual
description of value. (Quantum theory is an abstract intellectual
reality.) Coherence is exceptionally important here, because coherence is
pre-intellectual harmony of artistic and creative expression - even Quantum
must have its elegant aspect, or it would be viewed as unworthy.
But these intellectual patterns have evolved in a relationship with
intellectually postulated lower levels of value - and our empirical
postulated as being rooted at these lower levels.
Now it may be interesting to note that Buddhists view Humans as having 6
senses; the 6th being what we in the West would, in the 21st century, rather
confusingly determine, 'Mind.'
But the diagram 2 in TEOC aims to show that there is no mind as such, or
indeed Subjects and Objects in the MoQ, rather, there are evolutionary
patterns of Quality emerging from nothingness, in a coherent move towards
nothingness. (Artistic creativity in all Human fields of activity -
social and intellectual abandons a sense of self.)
My suggestion is that we abandon out Western cultural baggage and embrace a
new and better description of experience. Perhaps your sense of 'weirdness'
a helpful sign that you are freeing yourself from old modes of thought?
I do hope so?
All the best,
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